Paulo Carvalho is an Educator, Innovator and Entrepreneur who has thought deeply about the disruptions and opportunities provided by Generative AI and who has just published a report on how he believes Generative AI will disrupt Foresight.
Interviewed by: Peter Hayward
Links
IF Insight & Foresight: www.ifforesight.com
ORION.AI: www.ifforesight.com/what-is-orion
Report "How Generative AI will transform Strategic Foresight": www.ifforesight.com/post/how-generative-ai-will-transform-strategic-foresight
Transcript
Peter Hayward: Generative AI. You hear a lot about it in the hype media, you overhear conversations that describe it as an existential threat and it is also a speculative gamble in the financial casino. Does it create new knowledge or does it just steal and repackage the IP of others. Is it a distraction or does it offer us potential pathways into working with complexity and uncertainty?
Paulo Carvalho: One of the things I have been exploring in a more intense way for the last two years is artificial intelligence and in particular Generative AI.
For me this is a disruptive technology. it's something that is going to have a huge impact in our lives. The economy. The geopolitics. In our professional careers. in our organizations. And one of the things that really interesting is that although most people believe this is important I don't think that we are seeing these changes from the same perspective. It's not clear and we are not thinking about the implications in the same way. I believe that we need really to take a closer look to what is really happening. I believe a lot of people, for different reasons, don't feel comfortable exploring this new world I understand that because we are having so many transformations and in particular technology changes that is impossible for us to understand what is happening in all fields, but particularly in AI and Generative AI. It's very important that people don't hide. It's really important for people in different levels to embrace it, explore, know what it is.
Peter Hayward: That is my guest today on FuturePod, Paulo Carvalho who is an educator, innovator, entrepreneur and strategy consultant based in Lisbon Portugal
Welcome to FuturePod Paulo.
Paulo Carvalho: Well, thank you so much for having me, Peter. It's really a pleasure to be here, and say that it's so important to have this kind of podcast and conversations about foresight and futures.
Peter Hayward: You're very kind. you have listened to FuturePod, so you know we start with the story question. What is the Paulo Carvalho story? How did you end up in the Futures and Foresight community?
Paulo Carvalho: Let me start by saying one of the things that is really interesting in my career, in my professional life, and it's also something that distinguish and differentiate myself from other professionals in this field, is that I encountered and fell in love with Foresight when I finished my graduation in economics and made made my master in economy and management of science and technology and innovation It was at that moment, in the very early stage of my, career.
I believe that I am a futurist, I am someone that, from the beginning, started exploring, making research about foresight and futures.
Throughout my 30 years of my professional career, I combined foresight and futures with economy, strategy, innovation, entrepreneurship, design, which is nowadays my space of work and research. This is not so obvious and I believe you already met and invited to the podcast people for whom foresight and futures is in the center of their lives and their careers, and then they combine and explore other fields.
This is how I see myself. I start working in foresight. I didn't start working in economy or strategy. I start with foresight and futures, and then I spread to other fields.
Peter Hayward: What is your practice? How would you describe your practice and what are the foundations of your practice?
Paulo Carvalho: Well, I usually answer that question in a four layer approach, one of the most important things when designing a project is to have a clear idea about the foundational principles of this field.
If you don't know the foundational principles, you are not going to apply, methods and tools or frameworks probably in the right way. So this foundational principles are very important and were built throughout decades in this field.
People from Wendell Bell to Gaston Berger or Richard Slaughter that we were talking about, they came up with these body of knowledge, this epistemological approach to the field. So this kind of basic things like to have a holistic approach, embrace the complexity, build or think with systems, have a peripheral vision about what you want to do, integrate rationality with creativity, but discipline the creativity because in most of these projects in foresight, you are always making some kind of divergence phases and then making convergences, phases of reasoning and others of exploration. So you need to bring creativity and intuition, but then make decisions and bring some kind of a more analytical approach. So, the first thing is: what are the foundational principles of foresight?
The second thing is … If we were able to take a picture of the future which we cannot do, the future will always be populated with different elements, driving forces, things that are going to be in that future landscape. It's very important to understand these basic concepts that are going to be into the future. So, for example, the second level are the most important concepts of the future.
What is the difference? If you look into the future, the landscape, you are going to recognize the landscape. So what is going to make you more uncomfortable? It’s not that you are not going to be able to recognize the landscape. You will recognize the landscape because the basics of the landscape are coming from the past and are going to be somehow projected into the future.
We call these large tectonic changes megatrends. These megatrends and some trends that are moving towards a specific direction are coming from the past and are going to be into the future. And you are going to recognize those elements of the landscape.
But the things that are going to put you in difficulties, or in a good position regarding opportunities, can be smaller. We call these weak signals or early warnings. They are very small or you don't believe they are relevant or you don't even see those kind of things emerging.
They are ambiguous. They are not framed in a narrative, in a a trend, and they can somehow suffer a process of amplification and become really important into the future. And then there are other kind of elements that they are not moving into one specific direction. They can bifurcaate. We call those elements uncertainties.
So you need tom understand these basic concepts that we describe as megatrends, trends, early warnings, weak signals, wild cards, black swans and uncertainties, and in particular critical uncertainties, which is the raw material to build scenarios.
Even before deciding what kind of methods and tools to use, you should know the foundational principles, the epistemology, the basics of the basics, and understand the most important concepts.
Then we can talk about tools, methods and frameworks. Regarding the tools and methods, whatever future you want to explore, we all have our toolbox. In my case, I am not just a practitioner, I am a researcher in the field, throughout my professional career I've researched all methods and I teach all methods. From methods that are more about creativity or ideation, methods that are more about exploring driving forces, making scanning, tools and methods that you can use to work with stakeholders and actors. This topic is really interesting because you don't see so many tools and methods that can bring the interaction between actors, and that is amazing because it's from the friction between actors and stakeholders that most of the opportunities and challenges emerge.
You don't have so many tools. Well, you have some, but it's not so common to see foresight projects or strategic projects in which you can see the interaction between key actors, and from those interactions you identify opportunities or research challenges. An this is because the methods that you have, or are over simplistic or they somehow become too complex to apply.For me is one of the spaces or areas of the methodology that I believe could be much more explored.
And then, of course, we have methods in which, I want to incorporate uncertainty in my projects, in my approach. You have scenarios, scenario planning. I use a lot of scenarios, scenario planning, but you can have different kinds of approaches to scenarios.
There are different methods of building scenarios. The way you can approach scenarios can be a very pedagogical way for people to understand what kind of methods and tools to apply. For example, if you are, and most of our projects nowadays are very co-creative and participatory projects, and you work with people, so if you are working in a co creative participatory project in an organization or in the company (private or public), you want to have tools and methods in which you can work with them in a very co-creative and engaging way.
So, in a workshop, you want to make everything visible, put stuff on the walls or whatever. If you want to make this, you probably will need to follow a scenario planning method that allows you to bring people throughout the entire process. This is one of the reasons why, for example, building scenarios using the logic-intuitive approach, which somehow ends up many times in a scenario matrix where you end up using two uncertainties with two configurations, and then you flesh-out each one of those scenarios … The reason why this is so popular is because from the beginning of the project until the end you can build scenarios and explore the implications and strategic options with a group of people in a co creative and visual context. If you have the opportunity to do it in a slightly different way, you can decid for a different approach. I'm going to give you the example of a very interesting method and tool that I use in some projects, the morphological analysis.
So what is morphological analysis? It's not very complex. Just because it's much more intuitive to build scenarios through a matrix we tend to force the process to end up with two critical uncertainties and from those uncertainties to have this kind of four quadrants, which are like the canvas for each one of the scenarios that you are going to describe, build narratives, flesh out.
But when we talk about, the cone of possibilities from Joseph Voros and think about the future, there are eventually more uncertainties that can be really critical uncertainties and that will allow you to build scenarios. Why don't you use more uncertainties to build scenarios?
Most of the times you have this matrix. It's because using more uncertainties with different configurations, the level of complexity explodes. The capability to incorporate or work in a co-creative workshop base it's impossible with level of complexity, we can’t navigate and bring a group of people in the exploration of thousands of combinations.
So, this is a very simple, illustration of how and when to decide for specific methods. If you want to make something which is really co creative, participatory, you want to work with people throughout the entire process in a workshop base, you need to choose specific methods. There are other methods that bring different value but there's always a trade off in this process.
The fourth layer are the frameworks. So for me, these four layers: the epistemology and the principles of foresight and futures. The second one is the basic concepts: Megatrends, trends, weak signals, wildcard, uncertainties, early warnings. The tools and the methods themselves.
And then, the framework for me is different layer.The framework is the canvas. you always need to have a framework, in which you understand how to put all of these tools and methods in a fluid, strategic, useful and relevant way.
Well, almost 15 years ago I designed a framework that I use all the time. There are many frameworks in strategic foresight. I created a framework that I call “Scanning, Sensing and Acting”. This framework starts with some of the most important things in any foresight project, even before you apply any kind of method or tool, which is the designing and preparation of the project. So the most important decisions in strategic foresight projects are those related with this basic questions: Who are you working for? Who is the client or organization that you are working for? What are the main purposes and objectives of the project? What is the strategic focus? What is the topic that you are going to explore? This seems very obvious, but sometimes it's not, and most offoresight project that don't work, the reasons are related with specific reasons like the absence or a wrong framing of the project. So it was that specific strategic focus or a specific topic that was not really well defined. And the second one, which is linked with the strategic focus is time horizon. Are you exploring the future for the next five years, for the next 50 years, for the next 100 years? It makes all the sense to have a long view, which is one of the distinctive elements of foresight. But, for example, I'm working a lot with the impact of generative AI. The long view in this specific topic can be 3 to 5 years. If you are starting a project on climate change, you need to talk about 50, 100 years into the future.
At least for us, this isb very obvious. But many times it’s not so straightforward for people that are not used top explore the future, and you need to be very aware of these things. Designing the project is one of the most important things in Foresight.
Then you can start scanning and you have so many options on the scanning, And then you can start making sense of the future. For example, scenarios are a way for you to make sense of the future in a very specific way. Sense making is, for me, one of the most important stages off any foresight project and, of course, in scanning or in sensing, you can choose from many different kind off tools and methods depending on what you want do, or the purpose of the project and the strategic focus.
If in the beginning of a project, the purpose was to make a decision or to embrace a more strategic oriented foresight project, that can create a strong sense of frustration because one of the most important things in strategic foresight is this capability to connect anticipation with action.
So the exploration of the future, exploring trends or building scenarios with the capability to make decisions based on that anticipation. And this connection is very fragile, sometimes don't even exist. It's not because you, the project or the team didn't want it, it's because they were unable to make this connection in a proper way you need a third vertex to this triangle which is the appropriation. If you want decision makers to really make decisions or to act upon the future you need to bring a third element, which is appropriation. Appropriation at two levels. Cognitive appropriation: no one makes decision if they don't understand what is at stake. You can build scenarios, you can make a scanning project, you can explore trends, but if the decision maker or decision makers don't really understand what is at stake at a cognitive level, they will never make a decision based on that future exploration.
The second level of appropriation is emotional appropriation. If you don't believe that those futures can really happen, you will not be able to, make this connection. You are not going to make people make decisions or alocate resources or time, do something based on that anticipation. This is one of the reasons why co-creation and participatory methods are the mainstream today. It's impossible nowadays, or it's very rare that you are in a project or you are involved in a foresight project in which you don't have this kind of a co-creative approach because you need to engage and involve the decision-makers and also other stakeholders into the process.
This doesn’t happens in the end of the project, it's in the beginning. They decision makers and stakeholders need to co-create the project with you. Today, you see a lot of people coming from design entering these fields and talking about speculative design. or fiction, design.
So it's the combination of foresight and futures with design thinking. I believe that nowadays it's very clear that this level of emotional appropriation, it's entering or are going to be even more important. And it's just not for you to create strong narratives with scenarios that can bring people into this emotional state that they believe this can happen you need to make people touch, smell and have a more experiential journey into the future. This is why for example you talk about future artifacts. Take people into the future. In a very experiential way.
Peter Hayward: What are you paying attention to that's emerging around Paolo?
Paulo Carvalho: When you are working on F oresight and Futures in a systematic way, you are always searching. One of the things I have been exploring in a more intense way for the last two years is artificial intelligence and, in particular, generative AI.
For me, this is a disruptive technology. It's something that is going to have a huge impact in our lives, the economy, the geopolitics, in our professional careers, in our organizations. And one of the things that is really interesting is that although most of the people believe this is important, I don't think that we are seein or interpreting these change from the same perspective. It's not clear and we are not thinking about the implications in the same way. I believe that we need really to take a closer look to what is really happening. And the first thing is to understand what is this.
When you talk about generative AI, most people don't know what generative AI really is. We all have our opinions, but the first thing is: what is GenAI? I believe this is really transformative.
You need to understand basic things, like the difference between,a foundation model, a frontier model and an assistant model, what is multimodality, or even a large language model and how they reason, how these things create and offers you specific content and knowledge. What are agents? This new paradigm of agents that are emerging? I believe a lot of people (for different reasons) don't feel comfortable exploring this new world, and I understand that because we are having so many transformations and in particular technological changes that is impossible for us to understand what is happening in all fields. But in particular in AI and generative AI, it's very important that people don't hide. It's really important for people in different levels to embrace it, explore it. Know what it is before you even say tht we humans have this very unique and singular nature and this large language models or generative Ais will never be able to to enter into areas in which we are humans completely distinctive. I will invite people to explore it to understand what is at stake, what New world is just happening in front of us. What are the singularities of the generative AI.What is really distinctive in this new technologies. This capability of generating new things is really amazing, and I’m not saying this in a positive or negative way.
Because it's just a technology, it's neutral, so you can do amazing stuff. But also, there is some very dangerous pathways that we can end up with these new technologies. We never had a technology that was able to create new things, new knowledge, new content. It's becoming obvious that these technologies are going to be able to make decisions by themselves. This also never happened, right? You can see it already. If you explore these technologies, you can see how this is working and developing. For example, with this models you can make systems that are going to make decisions by themselves.
The third thing is, if these technologies are going to create new content, new knowledge, a new kind of creativity, and they are going to make decisions by themselves. One of the most important thing is what kind of ethical, moral standards, principles are we going to embed into these systems?
Generative AI is going to make these theoretical principles much more actionable. You are going to be able to embrace, to navigate, to explore complex systems, explore systemic thinking in a different level. So this is just an example of something that, it's not changing foresight and futures.The foundational principles of the field will continue to be the same, but these technologies, are going to be able to make those more actionable. For example, generative AI is going to allow you to navigate and explore complex systems in a different way. And then you need to be aware that these technologies can lack transparency. You can lose the trace of what is really into these systems. This kind of ethical transparency, security. This is going to be really important into, the future of foresight because, in my opinion, it's not if foresight is going to be transformed by generative AI, the question is how that is going to happen and at what speed.
Peter Hayward: Paulo, you wrote a paper called How Generative AI Will Transform Strategic Foresight. It's an interesting paper. what are you hoping to do with the paper and what's next?
Paulo Carvalho: Well, the paper was important for me because we all need to understand what is at stake with AI, and in particular, generative AI. I am someone working in futures and foresight for more than 25 years, I decided to write something that also could help others that work in this field to understand what is at stake. So. the first objective was to explore the implications that generative AI is going to have in our field.
This is why I started the paper with, first, what is generative AI in a very basic way. Most of the people don't know what is generative AI first. Even people that work in tech, technology. So, what is, and the second thing is: what are going to be the impacts of generative AI in the basic principles of foresight.
Something I mentioned before. The second part is how generative AI is going to change our practice and practices, our methods, our tools, our frameworks. And I believe that is going to be massive. Generative AI is going to change our basic assumptions and theoretical foundations about foresight.
They are going to change the way that they can be really actionable. And the way you currently make foresight from the most basic things like scanning or make a deep dive on a specific topic or even the way you can build scenarios.
For example, I was mentioning this idea that why can we or why don't we see so many morphological analysis? In a process of scenario building it's because until now it was difficult and complex to make the morphological analysis because you need software and there are not so many software that you can just use because they are not available now this is going to change That is not, so much about generative AIs, you are going to be able to make some kind of code and apply morphological analysis to whatever system you are working with. you are going to be able to explore in a more complex way.
Some say that you, had to simplify and approach it through uncertainties, scenarios, metrics. I'm not saying it's not a good method. until now, you were forced to specific approaches or methods because of technical limitations.
That is going to change completely, right? the way that you are going to be able to use different kinds of methods in a different way, And we were talking also about the emotional appropriation of foresight and futures, because if you want someone to act upon the future, you need to convince them to live into those futures.
And generative AI is going to change this completely. So even today, if you explore some of these technologies. Always in a conversational mode. Don't take for granted whatever. The technology is giving you always have this kind of interactive conversational approach with this kind of technology.
But if you explore these now, you can see that they are really interesting ways for you to build new kind of narratives, new kind of, experiences and in the future, probably new ways of, make people live into the futures, which is something that's going to be really interesting. Of course, we are going to have challenges, ethical issues, transparency issues, but, I don't think that This is going to be how are we going to travel and work and explore this, new world this has amazing opportunities, in the future in this regard.
Peter Hayward:You're the paper, of course, we'll have a link to it on your show page. are you open to people reaching out to you about what's in the paper Yes, one of the purposes for why you put it out.
Paulo Carvalho: You are going to share the link. it's completely Available, free for download.
People can also find the paper in my website. From my company IF Insight & Foresight, that I’ve created five years ago. It's a think tank and consulting company, and people can also find different kind of content. That paper also, and that we didn't talk about because we didn't have the time, but one of the things that I've been working is in a, a digital platform to make scanning and intelligence using generative AI.
So it's an example of how you can apply and use generative AI on the top of something that most of us, individual and organization, this field we're doing for many years, which is collecting driving forces, trends, mega trends, signals of change, articles, news. what I have made with Orion was on top of a database of 1, 400, trends, structured and curated, and an additional layer of 30, 000 elements, which are signals, which are structured but not curated articles, reports that you take from the net or whatever, this is something that most of the people that work in Foresight does. Not necessarily with this kind of approach, one of the things you can do with generative AI is to offer a way for people not only to explore and navigate your own databases that are updated almost in real time, but to create new knowledge that combines these structured database with the knowledge that are possible from these LLMs or other models. This is an example of how generative AI is going also to allow you to make things that were almost completely impossible to make two years ago.
People can find Orion and explore it to have a flavor of what is a digital platform that allows you not only to make scanning, but also to design and implement the full strategic foresight project you have a copilot that in the instructions have all the scanning sensing and acting framework you start with a hello and they sit. So the copilot just ask you, do you want to make a scanning or do you want to make a full strategic foresight project then guides you through all the steps of the design and implementation of a strategic foresight project. Starting from the identification of your organization or your client .What are the objectives of the project? What is the strategic focus? What do you really want to explore? Or what is the time horizon? What are the decision makers? What are the stakeholders?
You can choose different methods in the scanning stage. Do you want to make a features wheel? Or do you want to embrace a deep dive of specific trends? Do you want to make a megatrends deep dive? Do you want to build scenarios? how you can build scenarios, from a list of driving forces, trends weak signals on wildcards, and a number of potential uncertainties. Can help you to build scenarios. Then you enter in the Acting parts and is going to interact and explore with you what kind of things you can do in this more acting decision and strategic part of the framework.
So this is an example of how a generative AI copilot can guide you through an entire strategic foresight project. You are telling the system or the copilot, what are your specific things, topics, who are you as an organization, or what is your client if you are working for a specific client, these small things that make all the difference.
Thanks.
Let me just also present a definition of strategic foresight. Well, this could be the first, topic of our conversation, I would like at least to give you my approach and my definition.
Of course, it's inspired and basing the history foresight and many authors and institutions. As you know, we as humans have this capability of living in the future. We are a species that can think about the future and can plan for the future.
But most of the times we are making this in a very automatic way. So we are just planning for tomorrow. Or what is going to be my agenda for the next week, or the next month. We are engaging in what Daniel Kahneman, Nobel prize of economy, although psychologists, mentioned like the system one. So we are in automatic mode. When you talk about foresight, we as individual human beings, have this capability but most of the time we are doing this kind of automatic short term foresight. This is not what we are talking about here. When you talk about foresight and futures, we are talking in changing or moving towards from the system one (automatic way of thinking about the future) into a more structured oriented approach to the future.
So this is foresight. Foresight is our capability of thinking, exploring, imagining, designing the future or the futures not in an automatic, intuitive way, but in an organized, structured, co-creative and participatory way.
And the the most important thing is that we need to make foresight in the way that can and should be useful for someone. Because if we are exploring the future, you can do an amazing, beautiful project about the future of something, but if you are not useful to someone, that is a problem for foresight and for the field.
It's exactly like when you talk about innovation. Innovation is not patents, it's not creativity, it's not technology, it's not research and development, it's not inventions. It's only innovation when we can use or combine some of these in something that is useful and that's something that someone is going to value and in the end, for example, is going to pay for.
So this analogy, I believe it's really important for Foresight and for our community. Foresight should be useful and the usefulness of Foresight can be in some situations just to explore the future. Sometime organizations and institutions, they just want to explore the future. They just want to identify the risks or opportunities. But in other moments, organizations and individuals want to make decisions. They want to act upon the future. So if you are not able to help them. To make this link, between anticipation and action, we are failing.
Why Foresight is in a hype mode. Why is everybody talking about Foresight, right? Peter, you know that this is not the first hype in this field. We saw foresight or scenarios having this kind of hype in the last 60, 70 years. So why is foresight nowadays so interesting, so attractive, so sexy?
The basic response is because you cannot predict the future and the future is turbulent, complex, and uncertain. When you have something that is uncertain or unpredictable, you can find something we call uncertainties. The question is, do you find, do you identify, do you face uncertainties in your organization, your industry or your sector or your country? This is usually a question I ask but when I ask thi people start thinking and what they are thinking is “Well, to be honest I don't think that way. I rarely think about uncertainties.” This happens because people and organisations don’t know what t do with uncertainties. And the reason is because they are not used to do it.
So this is one of the reasons why futures literacy is so important. Make people understand the basics of foresight and futures. The epistemology, the basic principles, the basic concepts. This idea that you need to have the capability to talk about the future, to have a conversation about the future, a dialogue about the future.
It's the same as financial literacy or digital literacy. People, organizations, and institutions need to have this capability because the knowledge about the future is one of the most powerful things you can have. If you don't learn to think about the future, most of the times when you are trying to think about the future and make that knowledge useful, it's not going to work properly.
There are so many people that have a passive or reactive approach towards the future. We can think about four attitudes about the future. You are passive, you don't think about the future. The second one is you are reactive. The organizations and people that they believe that well, I don't take so much time and resources to think in a formal way about the future, but I'm really fast and flexible. So when the future comes, I'm really flexible and fast. That's not, at least for me, a good idea.
You need to add two attitudes about the future that, in my opinion, are the basics of foresight and futures. The pre-activity, anticipate the future. It’s what the majority of us in this field does, think about the field, explore the field, build scenarios, scanning the future, whatever, and then add a fourth attitude about the future, which is be proactive. There is this beautiful phrase and statement from Seneca, which is: If you don't know where you want to go, there are no winds that can help you. If you are in the middle of a storm and you don't know where you want to go, nothing is going to help you. The smaller you can be, organization, country or city, you have the capability to control something. and influence something.
So we never should think about foresight, just as an exploration or an anticipation of the future. It’s a a combination of that with what do you want and ca do abou it.
In the French school of foresight, called La Prospective, Gaston Berger, Bertrand de Jouvenel, Michel Godet (in Portugal, and many Latin countries, until very recently, we used this word Prospectiva; now it's become much more mainstream to use foresight and futures), Prospectiva is the combination of preactivity and proactivity. This capability of combining this anticipation with this kind of a proactive approach. This is one of the most important things about this field.
Peter Hayward: Paolo, it's been a fascinating conversation. Thank you for the paper on generative AI and foresight. And thanks for taking some time to spend it with the future pod community.
Paulo Carvalho: Thank you, Peter. Let me, explain why I believe this podcast is really important. when we talk about this interest or attraction that foresight is having currently or for the last years.
I believe this is not another cycle or hype. It's because currently we have something that we didn't have in the last four or five decades, one of the things we have is a huge amount of organizations and people that currently offers, people and organizations, the capability for them to learn foresight and futures.
In the past we had had a couple of global associations in the field. Nowadays, we have a huge amount of organizations and individual that can really teach the future so they can really create this mass of organizations and people that can learn futures literacy and also to be knowledgeable about what is foresight and how they can apply foresight.
One of the new layers of institutions or projects that really makes a difference and it's not just in foresight is this new reality of podcasts.
So what you are able to do is not just to teach. Or allow people to learn about foresight and futures.You are also able to create this kind of intimacy with the listener so that the listener can not only learn but also have an emotional connection. With you and with all the people that you invite to the podcasts. This is important not just in foresight. This creates what I believe is a large community of people and organizations that realy know what is foresight and avoid something like people saying, for me, scenarios are for me, foresight is for me, features will is no, it's not for you. There are dozens of author, researchers, practitioners that allow us to talk about foresight and futures the way that we are talking and applying currrently.
So, congratulations for your, for your podcast, for the love that you have to the field. The way you bring people to talk about their own lives and experiences that is this is really an add on and a more inspirational layer and emotional layer Makes people fall in love with different things and one of the things that people are going to fall in love with your podcast is about future studies and foresight. It was an honor to be here with you, Peter, and I hope that I add a small drop to this ocean of futurists and people that believe exploring the future can make a difference.
Peter Hayward: Thanks, Paolo.
I do strongly recommend you to grab a copy of Paulo's report into how Generative AI will transform Strategic Foresight. It is an excellent entry pathway into this quite interesting space. FuturePod is a not-for-profit venture. We exist through the generosity of our supporters. If you would like to support the Pod then please check out the Patreon link on our website. I'm Peter Hayward thanks for joining me today. Till next time.